16 Replies Latest reply: Feb 24, 2016 10:04 AM by jerryl RSS

2009 vs 2016

vickisocal Platinum
Currently Being Moderated

A nostalgic look back at the way things used to be. Circa 2009.

 

Let's suppose a hypothetical Platinum member wanted to spend a week in Europe on points.

 

2009 -

 

Redeem 7 night travel European hopper 150 K points, 3 nights in Paris, 4 nights in London

 

50 K points- Spring Megabonus- 25 nights

95K points from same 25 nights- 190 dollars a night x 10 points base, x 5 points plat, x 5 points and Marriott credit card

5K 500 point arrival  times 10 stays

 

2016-

 

redeem 7 nights at Cat 9 hotels, one night free if one stay is 5 nights = 270K points

 

30K Spring Megabonus- 25 nights

120K points from same 25 nights- 240 (I'm assuming average room rate is up that much from 2009) dollars a night x 10 points base, x 5 points plat, x5 points and Marriott credit card

5K 500 point arrival  times 10 stays

 

Congratulations you are 57% of the way there.

(For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

  • Re: 2009 vs 2016
    jakeal Gold 15 Reviews
    Currently Being Moderated

    An interesting analysis vickisocal. Two things stick out for me:

     

    1. Megabonus in 2016 earns less points; however if I recall the lodging industry was not doing so great in 2009. Hyatt has no Winter/Spring bonus this year, so I am happy Marriott does.

     

    2. The arrival gift has not improved in the span you reference above and some might argue has actually been devalued (in food/beverage amenity).

    (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

    • Re: 2009 vs 2016
      vickisocal Platinum
      Currently Being Moderated

      What sticks out for me is that while points earning has remained relatively constant, redemption has gotten much more pricey.

      (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

      • Re: 2009 vs 2016
        phctourist Platinum 20 Reviews
        Currently Being Moderated

        I still maintain, that the way to look at it is "How many nights do I have to stay to get a comparable room on points?"

         

        Prices go up in dollars and prices go up in points.  That is called inflation.  Only if the latter exceeds the former, is the program being devalued!

        (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

        • Re: 2009 vs 2016
          vickisocal Platinum
          Currently Being Moderated

          Yes, and in my example, after 25 nights/10 stays our hypothetical plat member had far more "buying power" in 2009 than now. My husband has been platt for 9 years and his stay patterns haven't varied that much 80-120 nihgts a year give or take. What we get with those points has dropped a lot.

          (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

        • Re: 2009 vs 2016
          jerryl Platinum 2 Reviews
          Currently Being Moderated

          I don't know in the hotel industry but do know in airlines( I assume it is the same) that companies must record as a liability point / miles balances. That becomes a hit to earnings so devaluing points/ miles does impact bottom lines. Yes 2009 all hotels/ carriers were chasing both company and individual travel dollars and one way  was  more points/ miles. You have seen airlines all go to dollars vs miles to reward the people that pay the most. They all provide points/ miles to other companies which they get paid . With mergers you get fewer options and no need for a company to be too out in front of their competitors and to give too much credit for points. So will the point continue to de value yes will they devalue more than prices going up  not clear. But the good old days will not likely return . To me the best benefit for hotel loyalty is the concierge. Regarding points as long as I can get a couple long uses for points at vacation areas I am happy. 

          (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

          • Re: 2009 vs 2016
            vickisocal Platinum
            Currently Being Moderated

            Can't any guest use the concierge? I've used them twice in 9 years, I tend to plan and make all my reservations myself.

            (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

            • Re: 2009 vs 2016
              jerryl Platinum 2 Reviews
              Currently Being Moderated

              gold and platinum and I think if you pay to stay on that floor you also get access

              (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

    • Re: 2009 vs 2016
      ks77 Gold 23 Reviews
      Currently Being Moderated

      I agree, especially with point #2. They should bump it up to 750 points at least.

      (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

  • Re: 2009 vs 2016
    superchief1 Platinum
    Currently Being Moderated

    If you are a MVC owner, this situation is substantially worse. I have owned my timeshare in Orlando since Royal Palms was built in the 80's. One incentive was that I could convert my week for 110k MR points. At that time, 110 k could be redeemed for 7 nights at any Marriott resort worldwide, two free roundtrip airline tickets on most major airlines, one week free Hertz rental, and buy one/get one free 7 night cruise. My maintenance fees in 1994 were $500.

     

    I still get only 110 k MR points for this week, maintenance fees were $900 in 2009, and are over $1200 in 2016 (still not bad for 1 week in a 2BR condo). As you might surmise, I never turn my week in for MR points any more. This is also why it is more difficult to redeem MR points for MVC properties because very few MVC owners exchange their weeks for MR points.

    (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

    • Re: 2009 vs 2016
      ks77 Gold 23 Reviews
      Currently Being Moderated

      One thought of mine, you guys can (and certainly will lol) correct me if I am wrong. If MVC owners are not inclined to switch their weeks for points and have not been for a while now, and more and more MVC owners are taking that path and not redeeming them for MR points, does that in turn mean that fewer MR points are being used for award stays overall? It's my understanding that category changes are driven by the free nights people redeem at all Marriott properties. Lots of MR points being redeemed for nights at a particular property makes that property go up in category. At least that is my understanding. So what I am getting at is, if MVC owners were to have a good redemption rate/value to convert to MR points, that might lead to more weeks being converted (a larger MR pool of outstanding points worldwide), more points being used for award stays, and the more award stays there are the higher categories properties will go. Therefore, when we see properties go down or stay the same, maybe this is a small reason why. Again, I may be wrong, it was just something I thought of.

      (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

      • Re: 2009 vs 2016
        superchief1 Platinum
        Currently Being Moderated

        You make an interesting point. I would expect that MVC owners aren't saving for and using MR rewards nearly as much as in the past, therefore their total contributions to award redemptions are likely declining. However, I'd expect that the new members and the expansion into other brands for point earning has generated significantly more total MR point redeemers, so the impact of fewer stays by MVC owner is relatively small. The Marriott family also doesn't have a whole lot of properties located near beaches or other vacation areas, so those vacation oriented location take a greater hit for MR redemptions.

         

        There were very few significant changes to the MR program for the first 20 years I was a member. Therefore I banked a lot of points over the years (over 1 million) that I had planned to save for when I had more time to travel. I never anticipated that the point level increases in the last five have exceeded those in the previous twenty years.

        (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

  • Re: 2009 vs 2016
    suzysharp Platinum
    Currently Being Moderated

    Interesting analysis Vicki. I hadn't realized how much redemptions had gone it. It would be interesting to compare the cash value of those stays from 2009 and 2016. Did they also go up at a similar rate? It would take a little sting out of the increase. =)

    (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

    • Re: 2009 vs 2016
      phctourist Platinum 20 Reviews
      Currently Being Moderated

      I have argued in several posts that it would be nice to know what the average change has been, by measuring how many nights' stays are required to pay for a comparable room in points versus some time in the past.

      (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

      • Re: 2009 vs 2016
        vickisocal Platinum
        Currently Being Moderated

        IMO

         

        Redemptions cost anywhere from 30-60% of what they used to

         

        Major earning sources for a plat-

         

        Arrival gifts- have not gone up

        Megabonuses- have not gone up

        Spend based earning- probably up around 20%

         

        See the discrepancy?

        (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

  • Re: 2009 vs 2016
    mikiegfla Platinum 4 Reviews
    Currently Being Moderated

    All of the posts here are so, so sad. I too yearn for the Rewards program of yesteryear, especially the original Honored Guest Awards of the 80's and 90's, where the customer was treated like royalty (sometimes even better!). I too took advantage of the Euro-Hopper and as a Vacation Club owner since the early 90's, took the 110k points every other year because they were worth so much. I guess that's what upsets me the most, that the 110k points were never increased at a time when the program was devalued.

     

    And lets not lose sight of two things my friends, back when Marriott announced the changes around this time in 2009, they hailed it as "an enhancement" and that the program was changed "based on member requests and survey results of what our members want in the program".

     

    Now I don't know about you, nowhere did I ask for a 40% devaluation and two new hotel categories.

    (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

    • Re: 2009 vs 2016
      phctourist Platinum 20 Reviews
      Currently Being Moderated

      I was in the Honored Guest program starting around 1990/91 as well as the Courtyard Club.  I became Silver Elite in the late 90s, and Platinum  around  2009.  I really don't see a significant devaluation over the years.  Some things have become better and others have become worse.  I do feel like a valued guest at Marriott.  I am almost always treated very well and often like an honored guest, with upgrades and special treatment. 

      (For each location tag, you will be guided through a 3-step process to add (1) a city and a state or a city and a country, (2) a Marriott brand, and (3) a Marriott hotel.)

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