AS many hotels are franchisee of marriott, there needs to be a website that allows rewards members to post which franchise hotel to avoid if you are a rewards member expecting rewards loyaltyperks such as upgrades. I am at a myrtle beach resort and spa at grand dunes That does not upgrade platinum members nor do they have insight into therewards program. 1. Marriott website should tell us which site is a franchise; 2. Marriott website should allow member review and feedback on the site for others to read regarding each hotel when making reservation, it should be directly available on the reservation site.
I would have been warned and avoided this hotel.
My understanding is that almost all the hotels are Marriott managed not owned. At one time, I heard that Marriott owned only 5 hotels. In reading other threads, it seems that many things ar up to the hotel. Marriott sets minimum standards that are expected to be met and some offer more. We all like upgrades but don't always get them. I have been platinum for many years and don't get upgrades that often. It may be the hotels that I stay at or that they are not available when I stay.
I agree with you that I would like to see Tripadvisor type reviews of the hotels that include treatment of elite members.
As of about two years ago, I was horribly treated at the Paris Rive Gauche, which I had stayed at many times and written rave reviews. But having used rewards (some of you will remember) and refusing to pay the add-on price, I was treated in a very ugly manner at the front desk (I speak fluent French, but this woman rattled off so fast that all I could get the gist of was that I wasn't getting anything better because I didn't pay more). I then got the worst room ever in the hotel facing the southern suburbs, and tiny. Every other stay (probably 8) had been phenomenal, and I'd been upgraded. Here I was treated horribly. Maybe it was one woman having a bad day, but still... I have not stayed there since and have made reservations for October in Paris at a non-Marriott hotel in the same part of Paris near the Bibliothèque Nationale since I can't afford the really high-scale ones (which are further away anyway -- and I got a deep hotel discount for booking the whole thing on Delta vacations).
It's funny, isn't it, how one horrible stay can outweigh about eight great ones?
PS -- When I posted a similar post on tripadvisor then, I did get contacted by the General Manager of Marriott in France thanking me for my comments and telling me he would address the situation. I'm sure most people since have the 8 times vs. the 1 experience, and I actually love the location, but I won't forget how I was treated.
This runs into another thread but one resort that I used to frequent told me, when I asked why I didn't get a better room due to my platinum status, that they blocked out rooms for the paying guests first accarding to elite status and such and then the same for "free" stays. I was using pts so it was considered a free stay.
I humbly disagree because I think we are all human and Marriott cannot always control its employees' behavior. 95% of the time I am treated amazingly well wherever I go by Marriott people (and usually at the 'lowest level' of the totem pole I am treated much better than at the front desk), but I think there are some -- like the desk agent at the Rive Gauche -- who was either not well trained (but she was in her late 30s or more), chose to be rude and give me a horrible room (with no recognition of status), and although we were speaking the same language (French), spoke faster than any French person I have ever spoken with. Since I've lived for years in France, I fully believe this was deliberate once I produced my passport and reservation. Although I was very pleased that France GM for Marriott contacted me after my new and utterly different review of the RG on TripAdvisor, I still will not stay there again. There are plenty of other places to stay, and most have matched my status.
I especially resented it because she made the outright statement that because I had not paid the extra amount for a Rewards room I would get the room I got (a cubbyhole). I was only overnight for 16 hours, but I would have stayed at the wonderful Paris Airport Marriott instead had I known I'd be treated horribly.
I really do want to emphasize that I treat everyone in a hotel like I would want to be treated. I tip very well, I always try to speak the language wherever I am, and I go out of my way to ask hotel maids, waiters, etc. how they are and sometimes even engage them in conversation.
I honestly wish I could clear RG's reputation from my posts had I noted the woman's name. If so, I would most assuredly have sent that info to France Marriott's GM.
It use to be rare that a marriott front desk person took out their bad day on customers. I am sure they had bad days, but it was not very visible to me. I can remember after a bad travel day showing up, when I was not particularly pleasant and being greeted by a friendly smile, and a simple statement, like we are sorry you are having a bad day, how can we make it better. Then I would be very embarrassed at my bad behavior.
For the most part, the front desk folks I have had, have been excellent.
The problem as I see it is that the standard benefits are no longer standard across all hotels. And it doesn't seem to be the front desk making these decisions. They are only the messengers of property management decisions.
This is where I think its going a stray, and I think we need to start tracking, property-by-property when we encounter this happening so other MIs have this as a reference. If a particular benefit is important for you, you would then have a better idea of how likely it will be that you will receive this benefit. For instance, if you are always up early and out of the hotel early, maybe you don't care about late checkout, so if someone has that problem at a property, it may not bother you. But maybe you stay over on Friday nights and fly home on Sat, and there is no breakfast included cause the CL is closed on the weekends and no breakfast is provided. If this is important and other MIs have noted this, you will avoid properties doing this.
Its either we track occurences, or we call in advance with our checklist to see what to expect since its no longer standard.
How sad it is that only several months ago, we were polling Insiders to rate the ADDED benefits we wanted/expected, and here we are lamenting the DIMINISHED benefits we are experiencing. No wonder people are upset!
In the meantime, Marriott corp has been eerily quiet regarding our thoughts on this subject. Specific subjects ignored: BOGO'S, Concierge Lounge open on weekends, Free breakfast coupons when it is not open, Upgrades to suites as a part of the program. Did I miss any???
I think the reason that Marriott is, "eerily quiet" is that they have no control over the situation anymore. Seems they have not alot of control over the franchises. I have been doing some checking up on Marriott franchises, trying to find a list, which I have not yet found. But I did find lists of awards to franchisers, and I suspect they are trying to incentivize them into honoring our benefits. Just reading tea leaves here.
I do not think I agree with your assessment. The control over the franchisees begins with creating the corporate policy. I recall a few specific examples. Subway creating the 'footlong' deal, McDonalds creating the 'dollar menu', etc. By doing so, the Corporations forced the franchisees hands. In this case, if there is no corporate rule on those benefits we desire, there is no chance in hell that a large group of franchisees would add benefits not forced upon them by corporate policy. Bottom line, the corporation needs to first set the policy, then attempt to police it.
Control over franchisees is in the licensing Agreement, and not all agreements are the same.
I suspect the amount of money to own a marriott franchise is significantly more than to own a Subway or McDonalds. Where there is more money involved, there is more lattitude for negotiation.
On the list of franchiser awards, many of those being honored owned many properties, and that has to be alot of money.
I am sure that if they invested that much they have significant say in how the operation is run.
This is the best description I can find on the Marriott organization structure and licensing.
has anyone seen anything with more detail?
Here is an example of a termination which resulted from franchisee not making payments. Its a fairly complicated situation as it involves bankruptcy and reorganization by creditors. Somehow I don't see any corporation going through something like this over loyalty program perks. Heck, their hands were even tied on a situation that sounds like criminal activity in Scrubb Island propbably until it can be determined that the criminal activity somehow involved employees and not some local grifter floating through.
Marriott Franchise Info todate
Mr. Marriott began shifting the company in the late 1970s from hotel ownership to property management and franchising. His strategic decision allowed the company to accelerate its growth and broaden its leadership position. That transformation culminated in the company's split into Marriott International, a hotel management and franchising company, headed by Mr. Marriott, and Host Marriott International, a hotel ownership company chaired by his younger brother, Richard Marriott.Marriott International is a worldwide operator and franchisor of hotels and related lodging facilities. Marriott International was formed in 1992 when Marriott Corporation split into two companies, Marriott International and Host Marriott Corporation. Operations are grouped into the following five business segments:
1. North American Full-Service Lodging Segment: Marriott Hotels & Resorts
1.1 JW Marriott
1.2 Renaissance Hotels
1.3 Autograph Collection;
2. North American Limited-Service Lodging Segment:
2.1 Courtyard by Marriott (Courtyard)
2.2 Fairfield Inn & Suites by Marriott (Fairfield Inn & Suites) - established & started franchising in 1983
2.3 SpringHill Suites by Marriott (SpringHill Suites) - established & started franchising in 1996
2.4 Residence Inn by Marriott (Residence Inn) - established in 1929 - franchising started in 1934
2.5 TownePlace Suites by Marriott (TownePlace Suites) - established in 1936 - franchising started in 1966
2.6 Marriott ExecuStay;
3. International Lodging Segment: Marriott Hotels & Resorts
3.1 JW Marriott, Renaissance Hotels
3.2 Courtyard by Marriott
3.3 Fairfield Inn & Suites by Marriott
3.4 Residence Inn by Marriott
3.5 Marriott Executive Apartments;
4. Timeshare Segment:
4.1 Marriott Vacation Club
4.2 The Ritz-Carlton Destination Club
4.3 The Ritz-Carlton Residences
4.4 Grand Residences by Marriott
5. Luxury Lodging Segment:
5.1 The Ritz-Carlton
5.2 Bulgari Hotels & Resorts.
Franchise Offer: Marriott International offers franchising programs that permit the use of many of their lodging brand names and systems by other hotel owners and operators. Under these programs, Marriott International generally receives an initial application fee and continuing royalty fees, which typically range from four percent to six percent of room revenues for all brands, plus two percent to three percent of food and beverage revenues for certain full-service hotels. In addition, franchisees contribute to the national marketing and advertising programs and pay fees for use of Marriott International’s centralized reservation systems.
Debated on posting this as its pretty rough and incomplete. Am having trouble finding all the info, so I thought by sharing, we could pool whatever information other folks have.
Do you think we should start a new thread?
I am thinking we need both the research, and fellow MI comments on where we are not getting our benefits like we are use to, and see if it relates at all to this org structure and franchising or not.
New Thread has been posted at the link below, with the Franchise information I have thus far, and a request for MI incidents of not receiving an anticipated benefit.
Once we see what type of information we get from members, maybe we can think about a more organized way to catalogue the incidents for review and future reference.
What do you think?
Found this article about franchising costs with almost all hotel chains:
It is a simple chart of costs associated with franchises (it does not address loyalty programs) but it does give you an idea how much it cost to be Marriott verses a Fairfield Inn.
going to check out that thread....
Hi this is my first post . Anyway I totally agree wtih GemPrincess and it is true that not all Marriott properties required to provide the benefit that is in the status. There is a "min" that is required and the rest is up to the individual itself weather to provide those benefits or not. For example Executive Lounge Access on the weekends in NA it seems they are closed and even that is based on properties. But when I travel to Asia I never have this issue at all. In terms of the evening's offerings (food
+ drink ) the food standard in NA compare to Asia its unbelievable. The quality difference is so huge is not even funny. I agree this is more a Marriott Management Issue for not standardizing the benefits and what is being offered. I am not sure about others but most frequent travelers one of the main reason why they pick on franchise over another is because of consistency in what they expect from a hotel. I believe we should have a thread to keep track of what benefits each properties provide vs others. This for me is very very useful and I would gladly contribute which I think other frequent travelers would too as this is very important in making a decision on weather to do the stay in a particular location or not.
Horrific treatment at the Courtyard Marriott Alexandria Va. I even wrote them and heard nothing at all in response if you end up in Alexandria stay any where but there.
* Zero benefits or care about status.
* I checked in with one of my new employees who has never stayed at a Marriott and they upgraded his room.
* Worse yet the gave me a room with two queens next to the Ice Machine and Elevator
* When I requested a room change they gave me a different standard room -- normally I would not care, except they upgraded someone who has no status.
* The most egregious issue -- I have gluten allergies and can only eat a couple items on the menu ala carte, the lady refused to give me my order cause she could not figure out how to ring it up on the computer. She did not offer an alternative or offer to find someone to show her how to do it -- She just said she can't help me, and asked the next customer in line for his order -- no apology -- nothing, nada!
* I waged complaints while I was there and the clerk said he would have the manager call me -- never happened. I also complained online and again nothing -- no response
It inspired me to investigate what Hilton has to offer. I just renewed Platinum for the year at Marriott. Hilton gave me Gold to try and win my business -- the few times I have stayed there have been pretty good. Don't get me wrong I have stayed at Marriott's faithfully for about 10 years -- six of them I was either Gold or Platinum, I also have the Marriott Credit Card and request my colleagues, and employees to stay there since that is where I prefer.
It's August and I have 81 nights so far and about 10 at the Hilton. Those 10 were inspired by the gross mistreatment at the Courtyard Marriott, I have at least another 20 to 30 nights coming up this year, it underscores that loyalty cuts both ways -- Until this year, I had never stayed at a Hilton, but the lack of concern of the staff and in action of the management addressing any of the issues made me consider a hotel where they wanted my business.
Bottom line: stay clear of the Courtyard in Alexandria, VA ~ you are better off staying at the MotorInn Motel, or any where else.
I had really bad experiences at Marriott Minneapolis West (in Minnetonka right by Ridgedale Mall) and Marriott Lake Mary, FL (near Sanford airport). Minneapolis West made my 89 year old father and 80 year old mother wait almost 2 hours for a room because theirs wasn't ready at 3pm, and this made them late for a wedding. They weren't even offered a drink or cup of coffee. My mom actually asked them for a cup of coffee, and they said no. Then the GM promised a certificate for a free stay as compensation (after I complained) but never sent it which is worse than not promising it at all. Lake Mary was bad, too. Incompetent front desk, room not ready until 6:30pm. Horrible service.